It takes a special breed to run a ski resort, but especially so in the Midwest. The hills are smaller, and the weather risks higher. No one knows this more than Dave Grenier, recently retired head of Snow Creek, Mo., and a longtime Peak Resorts executive, and Chip Perfect, owner of Perfect North Slopes, Ind. Both have operated resorts in the Midwest for 30 years or more. To paraphrase an old song: if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere.

Both agree that it takes passion to be successful—a passion to deliver a great day to guests. We sat down with them to talk about how passion played a key role in their past, and how they see management evolving in the future.

Share with us the moment you knew this was the industry for you.

DAVE: It happened precisely on July 3rd of 1986 when I got a phone call from [Peak Resorts chief and pal] Tim Boyd, who said, “Hey, what are you and Linda doing next weekend? We’d like for you to jump in a plane and join Missy and me in Kansas City.”

I had just gotten to be general manager of a stainless valve and fitting company in Cambridge, Massachusetts; just got a big raise and was finally pretty satisfied with my position. But the commute was a killer. I was leaving before my kids got up and coming home after they went to bed.

I told Tim, “I know what you’re doing here, you’re going to try to capture the Kansas City market.” I had always urged him to do that before someone else did. So I said, “I’m not interested. We’re New England born and bred. But, hey, we’ll come out on your nickel.”

So, when we were out here, he spun a dream, and we bought into it hook, line, and sinker. On our flight back home we changed our whole opinion about what we were going to do for the rest of our lives. We decided to take a heroic chance that this would actually work in the state of Missouri. I was back by September, building Snow Creek. I grew up in the Mohawk Valley of New York and skiing was my winter passion. I learned how to ski on small hills much like those in the Midwest. So I looked at [Snow Creek] and said, “This will work.” And here we are 31 years later, and it’s going strong.

CHIP: I have sort of a similar story to Dave’s in that I’m a farm kid from Gilford and I have a degree in agriculture. I was planning on teaching agriculture.

My dad ran his own business; we were farmers. My dad always preached the “be in business for yourself” mentality. He used to say, “When you work for yourself and it’s a beautiful day, you can go to the lake when nobody else is there.” But we never did that in my entire life. We never, ever did that. But hey, you “could!”

One day, a guy drove up to our barnyard. I’d just gotten out of college and was trying to figure out my life. It was the early ’80s, the economy was rough, and this guy suggested that we had hills that would lend themselves well to being a ski area. So that’s how the concept of the ski area got going.

One thing that’s maybe different for me than a lot of people out there is, my love is the ski business. I came to this, and what’s kept me going, is enthusiasm for the business of it. My passion has always been producing a day of fun for people. So, I knew this was where I wanted to be, I think, that first day we had a big crowd. At the end of the day you have that satisfaction of knowing you showed people a good time.

So, Chip: Did you learn to ski?

CHIP: Yes! I had skied one time, in college, before we started the ski area, and I was the most expert in the family. I just absolutely love the opportunities I’ve had over the years to ski with my kids. That’s been the most enjoyable part of it for me.

DAVE: I have to add something Tim Boyd said to me once while we were golfing—golf has always been a passion in my life. And that was, “Get into this business and you can golf all you want, all summer long.” And unlike Chip, I actually did!

It takes a special kind of person to have a long and successful career in this industry. What traits lend to that success?

CHIP: I’m coming up on 38 years in this, and I would say the number one thing is just to have excitement and passion for what you are doing. I mean, I get just genuinely excited as we are ramping up for each ski season. My three favorite days of the ski season are the first night we make snow; the day we open, it’s like Christmas every year; and the day we close.  In between, though, you’ve got to have that passion, too. I say to my full-time staff all the time: This is a lifestyle. This is not for everybody. If you cannot have that excitement for producing a ski day, you shouldn’t be in this.

DAVE: The first day we opened was January 1 of 1987. Tim Boyd and I walked into the building after taking a picture with our first customer, shook one another’s hand, and said, “Can you believe we pulled this off?” That is feeling that passion. I have loved every year of the 30 years I’ve been in it. I’ve never looked back and regretted any of the moves I’ve made. But you know, Chip, I always told my staff the day I liked the least was closing day. It takes a lot to bring those hills alive.

Share a pivotal career moment, something that went right or wrong, that you learned from.

CHIP: One of the things I always say I live for is “eureka moments.” In this industry, because of the breadth and the depth of the issues we deal with, I’ve had a lot of eureka moments. Unfortunately, I don’t have as many as I used to, but I still love it when I have them.

A turning point for me, when I started to see this more as a career than a job, was when [NSAA president] Michael Berry asked me to join the executive committee of the NSAA, and said that I was going to move through the ranks and ultimately be chairman. That was a really humbling and proud moment. It took a number of years to work through the program, but being given the chance to be the chairman of the National Ski Areas Association was one of those moments that you feel like: yes, you have a career, and you have a place in this industry. I’ve had a ton of moments, but I’ll never forget that one, because my answer was, “What? You want me?”

DAVE: “Eureka moments” is the perfect way to describe it. I would say one of the high moments of my career was when I was awarded, in August of 2003, the Distinguished Service Award from the Midwest Ski Areas Association. I just felt like a million bucks and said, you know, all the toil and turmoil that you actually go through in this business to try to make it work is all worth it when your peers recognize you. I was overwhelmed that people thought I had made that much of a difference, you know?

Who do you see as the future of the industry? Who are the people to watch?

CHIP: In the industry as a whole we are going through a significant transition from owner operators to what I consider professional managers. In the early days, our meetings were dominated by owner/operators, and by nature they are sort of independent, do-your-own-thing types. I mean, they wouldn’t have started a ski area if the were not maybe a little arrogant and, uh, over self-confident. That made for challenging meetings, because everyone was the boss.

We’ve seen a transition as we move to professional managers, people who have a background in whatever it is they are operating, be it IT or marketing or other things; people who come up and wear the hat because they’ve moved up the ranks as opposed to owning. Frankly, I think it’s a good thing for the industry. The level of professionalism is rising and rising. We have a young guy here, Jonathan Davis, who has been really innovative in the technology area for us, and is leading the industry in a lot of new ideas.

DAVE: Jonathan, and Jesse Boyd, both SAMMY award winners, are worth mentioning. And I’ll also mention Rob Walz. Rob would come to all the trade shows with his dad and never have the confidence to speak up for himself. I’d pull him aside and say, “Rob, you’ve got natural talent, and you just don’t see it. It’s time to tell your dad, ‘go enjoy the rest of your life,’ and you can take it from here.” And by god, that young man has seen the light and has just done wonders with Cascade [Wis.]. He’s an up and comer—god knows where the future lies with that young man.

I’ll also put a plug in for my own son Matthew, who has succeeded me as the general manager of Snow Creek. He now sits on the Midwestern board. I’ve encouraged him to get on the committee and rise up to chairmanship if they will let him, so we will see how that goes.

What keeps you up at night, and what motivates you to get up in the morning?

CHIP: Well, certainly: the weather. You know, Dave’s been one of my mentors on the weather as he has for many others. Particularly in the Midwest, we have built our infrastructure to deal with weather. But you are still at the mercy of Mother Nature, and I think Dave will agree that we do the best we can, but you get what you get.

DAVE: Absolutely, weather is something that keeps me up at night. I cannot tell you how many times I’ve been wide awake at night waiting for the winds to change from the south to the north. Weather’s been my amateur passion for 30 years now. In fact, sitting here with me is a weather diary of every day of the 30 years I have spent in this industry. The high, the low, rain, snow; I have a complete diary of the Kansas City weather for the last 30 years.

CHIP: Dave, I didn’t know that you kept that diary, and I’m sitting here trying to decide if that is really cool or really weird.

DAVE: As for what motivates me each day? I had the honor of working side by side, all these years, with my wife. What motivates me each day? Well, I got to spend it with her. Everyone scratches their head when I say that, but it was wonderful. We work together as a team, and we have now for many years. Yeah, that’s what made it all worthwhile.

CHIP: Dave is right. I will say that working with my wife and my son Alex at the ski area has been a highlight in my life as well. It’s really quite special. You are right on the money there, Dave.